VINs and serial numbers

[mminasi]

Dumb question --

I see many references to someone having bird number 8391 or the like. Where would you find that out? I understand that in theory Ford only made 25,000 of them.

My Tbird, which I got a couple of weeks ago, has a number around 21,000 on a tag attached to the key. Is that its number, or just an inventory number for my dealer? Or is there some way to deduce the ordinal number of the car? Not a big priority, just curiosity.

[5bird7]

Your VIN# can be found on several places on your car. The legal tag is on your dash and can only be viewed from the outside thru the windshield. It's a 17 digit number and the last 6 #'s are the numbers you're most interested in.
To see the vin# breakdown,
visit my webpage at vin decoder (http://www.geocities.com/thenewtbird/decoder.html)

or at
new tbird data site (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/newtbirddata/files/zdatadecoder.html)

You will also find "paper" tags in various locations on your car. under the hood and in your trunk. This tag will also have your VIN#. They should be there.
On one of those tags you will also find a 4 digit number right above the VIN#. This is called the sequence # -it will give you the actual sequence that your car went thru the assembly line but there is a catch.

If your VIN is between 100001 and 110000, and the sequence # is less than 9960 then that is your actual sequence #.

edited - scrap my explanation and use bluebird's below.

Theory was that Ford was ONLY going to make 25,000 BUT the production of the 2003s has been delayed by 3 months and we've heard from the Wixom plant that they will produce more than 25,000 and will continue production of the 2002s thru October. We have not had confirmation of that yet. My dealer is expecting their last car in this week and it's VIN # ends with 25597.

You may wonder why the VIN# doesn't coincide with the actual sequence # - The VINs are assigned well before the car actually starts being built at the plant. It gets out of sequence when parts aren't available or something else happens that will afftect when it actually gets to start down the assembly line. Each color is done in small batches which will also affect it's sequencing.

[mminasi]

Hi Dot --

Thanks. I knew where to find a VIN, sorry I wasn't clear on that. Basically what you're saying is that Ford DOES include a sequence number but that it rolls over in fairly dopey ways. No problem, basically it means that I have no way of knowing whether this car was the 10,000th or the 25,000th.

It IS odd, however, that all of the mid-2001 Web sites go on and on about how there will be only 25000 in 2002 and "they're all spoken for." I'd liked the TB since I saw the concept cars years ago and heard that 2002 was just plain going to be impossible so I figured I'd wait a year or two... so I was surprised to find that it was a snap to locate a White hardtop.

I guess at my age I should have learned by now the difference between Marketing Text and Reality. Thanks again.

[5bird7]

My husband reminded me that the tag with your key MAY be the code for your keys so hang on to that tag.

You can tell your actual sequence by adding up the numbers. Find the sequence # for your car and let me know the last 5 digits of your VIN and we can come up with the actual sequence #.

I think even my website states that there will only be 25,000. Haven't updated it with the latest info. We're always finding something new about these cars.

[bluebird]

It's simple to find out your sequence number, just compare your 4-digit sequence number to the last 5 digits of your VIN number and if they are not even close, add 9960 to your 4-digit number once or twice, whichever makes them nearer to each other. The resulting number is your actual build sequence number. Wixom has built 26,300 2002s and is still going strong.:thumbsup:

[5bird7]

thanks Ron, I knew you would have simpler method for determining it. :biggrin:

[2K2BIRD]

Can anyone explain why the magic number for the rotation is 9960 as opposed to any other 4 digit number? For that matter, why does it have to be a 4 digit number? Just wondering.....

[FordMan7]

I do not know why the number is now 4 digits - in the early '60's the rotation number was 3 digits. (or at least that was the case at the Mahwah Assembly Plant in '63)

Just for interesting discussion - Has anyone found their build sheet yet????

Ford has used these since the late '50's as a guide for assembly line workers to know what options to install, they are supposed to be discarded at the factory, but they usually end up beneath carpets, taped under the dash, etc.... I have found the sheet for every Ford I have owned with the exception of the T-bird....

If anyone has found - do tell about the location :thumbsup:

FordMan7:fordsrule:

[MATBird]

5bird7:
I checked out your site ref on this subject and still have a question. Under "Build sequence no." you have a s/n 101396 with a rotation # 0942 shown. In your explanation above it appears that the rotation no. is irrevelant and that this is the 1396th built. Am I reading this correctly?
The reason I ask is my s/n is 111681 and rotation is 1829 and I wanted to know exactly what number off the line it really was.
Thanks for all your good postings!

[5bird7]

matbird,, your sequence # is 1829 plus 9960 = 11789. Every serial number starts with 1 in the series of 6 numbers but remember we're only dealing with less than 30,000 cars or only the last 5 digits of your VIN#. I guess I didn't make that clear.

My Vin is 119005 and sequence #8588 so actual sequence of mine is 8588+9960= 18548

the example of vin# 101396 with sequence# of 0942 is the actual sequence # for that car - nothing needed to be added to it.

The following are hypothetical examples - not real.
the only place where it gets tricky is if someone had a vin# of, lets say 119959 and their sequence # was 0067 then their actual sequence # would be 9960 plus 9960 plus 0067 = 19987
It could also happen that someone could have a vin# 120031 with a sequence # of 9943 then their actual sequence # would be 9960 plus 9943 = 19903

[Gobird]

Boy , I'm glad mine was built in Jan. and the number showing is the right one without all this math. This is getting confussing. :lol::beer:

[5bird7]

yah, it would help if I could add, too :biggrin:

[MATBird]

Dot:
Thanks so much for the info!! Your description is a big help and I am sure the way you explained it many others will be able to use it in the future
Thanks again

[03bird]

Can anyone tell me what this means listed next to Vin # on an order acknowledgement.
HP60A 3. These are the only numbers listed
Thanks Dick

[5bird7]

The letters will be part of your VIN#
H = Passenger restraint
P = Passenger car
60 = Model # (Thunderbird)
A = Engine
and
3= year 2003

for a breakdown of the VIN#,
visit:
decoder (http://www.geocities.com/thenewtbird/decoder.html)

and you will see where those codes fit into your VIN#

[5bird7]

Now that you have your order acknowledgment, do you know where you fit into your dealer's allotment?

With the latest word that the 2003s will only be built for 7.5 months, we can give you an estimate of when your car might be built if you know how many cars your dealer is getting and where you stand in line. We're assuming that Ford will divvy them out in a similar manner for this next model year as they did last year.


The last 5 digits of your VIN # will probably be assigned about 2 to 6 weeks before your car is built. That's if things go according to how they went during the last 6 months of production of the 2002.

[03bird]

Yes My dealers allocation is 1. I don't have the slightest idea when it will be built
Dick

[5bird7]

I would suspect that it would be built between mid-November and mid-January - assuming they use the same system they used for the 2002. Once built, it takes up to 4 weeks for delivery, depending on where you live in the states.

I would start checking with your dealer at the beginning of November to see when your car's status changes from "unscheduled/clean" to a full vin #. Your dealer is able to get weekly updates on the status of all cars they have on order. Ford updates the status on Thursdays.

[Skip]

I guess this is the best place to post this info-I don't see a need to start a new topic. I visited my Ford dealer earlier today. The owner advised me that they are getting two additional Birds to their allottment. This is in addition to the two extra allottment cars they have in stock, and one they sold earlier, for a total of 5 over their allottment. The two additional cars coming are scheduled to be built on October 14, and have serial #'s 29340 & 29341, respectively. So much for 25,000 total production. As Dot and others have mentioned, they expect fewer cars to be built in '03, probably in the 20K range. The dealer did not know about the price increases yet.

Skip
Red/Red/Red Premium #1768

[bluebird]

Apparently, the 25,000 now means calender year, not model year. 19,000 T-birds have been built since January, right on schedule for the 25,000. Ford will start building the 2004s in July, that means only about 15,000 03s will be built.

Those high VIN numbers are interesting since the low 27000s are being built now.

[roseybird]

The last 5 digits of our '02 VIN is 03624 (all 6 would be 103624) and the sequence # is 2959 - this means that ours is #3624 - RIGHT?

[5bird7]

no, it means yours is the 2959th built. Your vin# was assigned well before it started on the assembly line and got moved up in the process by about 600 cars - possibly due to color or interior choice.

[roseybird]

THANKS for the clarification! Now I can sleep peacefully, tonight!!:lol:

[MATBird]

Dot:
I'm confused. When you helped me with mine we added 9960 to the rotation number to get the no.
Therefore wouldn't Roseybird be 2959 + 9960 or the 12,919th built? Or am I mis-reading the post

[A Justin]

Originally posted by bluebird
It's simple to find out your sequence number, just compare your 4-digit sequence number to the last 5 digits of your VIN number and if they are not even close, add 9960 to your 4-digit number once or twice, whichever makes them nearer to each other. The resulting number is your actual build sequence number. Wixom has built 26,300 2002s and is still going strong.:thumbsup:

MATbird read the above post for clarification of this and your question.

[5bird7]

Mat, BlkMustnggt is right. Look at her vin# again - it's an early car when not even 9000 of them had been built yet. No need to add the 9960.
Your car was a much later build.

[MATBird]

Dot and Justin:
Got it, Thanks. Guess I should have read the post closer.