tleslie
Nov 3, 2002, 10:24 PM
As all of you know there is alot of misinformation on the internet and I hope I can clear some of it up. I will post some of my thoughts and am thinking about posting a thunderbird fix-it site with what I have learned.
I was graciously invited to take my Thunderbird back to its birthplace at Wixom for a quality check. Mr. Larry Fisher (Manufacturing Liaison) and Mr. Jim Smyth (The Thunderbird Doctor as I like to call him) were more than happy to take my bird and place it through a quality check. I had a 1 on 1 tour of the plant with Mr. Fisher, et al and it was not just a walk, it was a learning event. He asked me questions that were difficult so I could think like an engineer, etc. I think of myself as a human engineer (I am a physician), but it was difficult none the less.
We walked through the plant backwards and I realized the amount of planning and engineering that went into the bird. The employees were happy to see a customer and were very honest about past and current problems/changes to the birds. Some thoughts:
1. DONT RETORQUE THE CROSS BRACE BOLTS. This was stated over and over again. Cowl shake appears inevitable, but triangulation and stiffening the ride has been taken into account. I personally talked with 2-3 people about this and they pleaded not to retorque. It appears that a service bulletin has been sent on this matter. Tires need to be at 30 lbs, not 32 as I grew up with. I could tell the difference coming back from Wixom. The 03 bird has a few more bolts in the Middle X Brace due to increased horsepower Approx: 280 horses. I mentioned that the forum stated that Dave Davis ok'd retorquing - THEY DENOUNCED THAT ENTIRELY AS CRAP.
2. Water leaks. It was funny, but on the way to Wixom my dealer called me and stated that my parts were in. I didn't order any parts, but because I said I had a leak, the service manager decided on his own to replace a seal over the drivers door. WRONG!!! Multiple people at Wixom, including Mr. Fisher just shook their heads in dismay. My car had a small water leak of both the hardtop and the softop at the left front attachment to the windshield. My car was evaluated, the hardtop was adjusted (there appears to be 2-4 ways to adjust the fit of the hardtop) and the windows were elevated and adjusted a bit. The leak is gone. I went through a touch less carwash immediately after leaving Wixom at 1300 psi with no leaks. I would wait before letting any dealer replace seals until they get a handle on how to adjust hard and soft top mechanisms.
3. Wind Noise - Let me tell you as a physician I have a keen sense of hearing. Sometimes too good. The wind noise behind my left ear was driving me crazy. I tried everything. I even stuffed insulation in the hardtop lever mechanism, but this did little. Ford has a neat machine that you can place inside the car, turn it on, and search from the outside (windows up) in order to find a leak. My ear was not playing tricks on me and the Tbird Doctor (Mr. Smyth) fixed it by raising the window and adjusting it inwards a bit. Something they are starting to do on all the birds for a tighter fit. It is important to wait a split second before opening the door in order to let the window drop. My wind noise behind the left ear is about 80% gone. I think the rest is road noise, but I will again ask Mr. Fisher on what to do next.
4. Trailer hitches - everyone frowned upon this. There are a few engineering issues here, but Mr. Fisher didn't want to talk about it. I think he felt it destroyed the car.
5. Leather - My passenger seat came apart at the lower front. A long piece of plastic that connects the leather to the metal chair frame is difficult to reattach. This was fixed without too much problem. Remember that the leather is real and has defects as the cows do. I call them character marks. I have one on my armrest in the center of the car.
6. Wheels - Mr. Fisher states that the plating is of the highest quality.
7. The underpan - the part that can be seen from the side of the car. In the past somebody wanted to bend it, repaint it, etc. WRONG! This will destroy engineering integrity. For light colored cars it is supposed to be blacked-out. Some cars didn't get a good paint job at this area per Mr. Fisher and we saw one at the plant.
8. Paint - for my white bird, Mr. Fisher said all I would ever need is Maguire's Gold. The Thunderbird Blue is not metal flake, but a mica compound.
9. Jacking the car - remember that a floor jack that is improperly applied too far outside of the frame can crumple the front fenders. You need to get the floor jack inside the outer fender on a solid part of the frame. They agreed that the jack sent with the car is almost worthless.
10. Quality checks - I was unaware that Ford has an electronic way to check that the person putting bolts on at "THE CRITICAL POINTS" doesn't miss any. The wrenches are electronically monitored and can pull up all sort of data.
11. Drive shafts - the drive shaft when already attached to the rear axle assembly is tested for balance at about 80 MPH to a point down to 0.7 grams. Anything out of balance more than that is adjusted with weights and rebalanced.
12. Hard Top Abrasion - this has been a sore spot. The phantom chrome strip was indeed tried, but it caused just as much abrasion as did the hard top gasket itself so it was scrapped. The tape system "was not meant to look beautiful" said Mr. Fisher on more than 1 occasion. I think they are still looking into this and I do not accept it as a good fix either. The legal case in Chicago against Ford on this issue needs to proceed as I don't think they are in a big hurry to fix this item. I mentioned the Expel system and there was really no comment. Sorry race fans!
13. Soft top storage - it was mentioned that if a car is stored over the winter that the soft top should be in the upright and locked position, otherwise it could have shrinkage and be difficult to return to the locked position.
2003 Model
I saw the new color called Mountain Shadow Gray and it was really impressive. It appears to have a mica like the blue. It also had the glove interior with a glove boot over the shifter knob. Just in front of the shifter knob were 2 switches (where the current panel is empty) and these are for the heated seats. The V8 emblem is on the side panel of the car "So we can tell the 02's from the 03's". I personally don't like them. The 03 has 280 horses as does the 03 Lincoln LS (a beautiful new look and my next purchase as soon as I get a Ford Pin# for a better deal). The supercharged version will be out before 05 as previously listed. Mr. Fisher said a few were out and being tested, but I didn't see any (Roush racing appears to be the supplier). I didn't see any Coral colors and I think I saw an 03 painted in thunderbird Blue, but I could have been mistaken.
All in all my trip was well worth the trip and I am sure it saved alot of headaches (rather than dealing with a well intentioned, but poorly informed service manager at my local dealer). I was very impressed by the engineering (dynometer of all cars, drive shaft balancing to almost immeasurable specs, state of the art painting systems, electronic monitoring of tools used for critical areas, water/air leak testing, triangulation engineering for the cockpit) and the quality control measures used to assure the Tbird enthusiast a pretty car as well as a car that is safe and dependable. We all waited through the fan modulator crap and Mr. Fisher was bluntly honest that it was a tough problem to find and fix. Some crappy parts were brought in from an Asian supplier. They admit that the tape system is poor and not beautiful, but until more people complain I doubt that a quick fix is in store. Buy stock in the Expel system. Otherwise it looks like Ford wants to stand behind this project and looks forward to making a stronger as well as faster Tbird (a nameless employee muttered - soon we will have a real motor). This is why they are stiffening the ride even more. Drive on all tbird enthusiasts and you always have a warm and dry garage in Findlay, Ohio to store your bird and have a beverage or two. Warmest regards, Todd Leslie
I was graciously invited to take my Thunderbird back to its birthplace at Wixom for a quality check. Mr. Larry Fisher (Manufacturing Liaison) and Mr. Jim Smyth (The Thunderbird Doctor as I like to call him) were more than happy to take my bird and place it through a quality check. I had a 1 on 1 tour of the plant with Mr. Fisher, et al and it was not just a walk, it was a learning event. He asked me questions that were difficult so I could think like an engineer, etc. I think of myself as a human engineer (I am a physician), but it was difficult none the less.
We walked through the plant backwards and I realized the amount of planning and engineering that went into the bird. The employees were happy to see a customer and were very honest about past and current problems/changes to the birds. Some thoughts:
1. DONT RETORQUE THE CROSS BRACE BOLTS. This was stated over and over again. Cowl shake appears inevitable, but triangulation and stiffening the ride has been taken into account. I personally talked with 2-3 people about this and they pleaded not to retorque. It appears that a service bulletin has been sent on this matter. Tires need to be at 30 lbs, not 32 as I grew up with. I could tell the difference coming back from Wixom. The 03 bird has a few more bolts in the Middle X Brace due to increased horsepower Approx: 280 horses. I mentioned that the forum stated that Dave Davis ok'd retorquing - THEY DENOUNCED THAT ENTIRELY AS CRAP.
2. Water leaks. It was funny, but on the way to Wixom my dealer called me and stated that my parts were in. I didn't order any parts, but because I said I had a leak, the service manager decided on his own to replace a seal over the drivers door. WRONG!!! Multiple people at Wixom, including Mr. Fisher just shook their heads in dismay. My car had a small water leak of both the hardtop and the softop at the left front attachment to the windshield. My car was evaluated, the hardtop was adjusted (there appears to be 2-4 ways to adjust the fit of the hardtop) and the windows were elevated and adjusted a bit. The leak is gone. I went through a touch less carwash immediately after leaving Wixom at 1300 psi with no leaks. I would wait before letting any dealer replace seals until they get a handle on how to adjust hard and soft top mechanisms.
3. Wind Noise - Let me tell you as a physician I have a keen sense of hearing. Sometimes too good. The wind noise behind my left ear was driving me crazy. I tried everything. I even stuffed insulation in the hardtop lever mechanism, but this did little. Ford has a neat machine that you can place inside the car, turn it on, and search from the outside (windows up) in order to find a leak. My ear was not playing tricks on me and the Tbird Doctor (Mr. Smyth) fixed it by raising the window and adjusting it inwards a bit. Something they are starting to do on all the birds for a tighter fit. It is important to wait a split second before opening the door in order to let the window drop. My wind noise behind the left ear is about 80% gone. I think the rest is road noise, but I will again ask Mr. Fisher on what to do next.
4. Trailer hitches - everyone frowned upon this. There are a few engineering issues here, but Mr. Fisher didn't want to talk about it. I think he felt it destroyed the car.
5. Leather - My passenger seat came apart at the lower front. A long piece of plastic that connects the leather to the metal chair frame is difficult to reattach. This was fixed without too much problem. Remember that the leather is real and has defects as the cows do. I call them character marks. I have one on my armrest in the center of the car.
6. Wheels - Mr. Fisher states that the plating is of the highest quality.
7. The underpan - the part that can be seen from the side of the car. In the past somebody wanted to bend it, repaint it, etc. WRONG! This will destroy engineering integrity. For light colored cars it is supposed to be blacked-out. Some cars didn't get a good paint job at this area per Mr. Fisher and we saw one at the plant.
8. Paint - for my white bird, Mr. Fisher said all I would ever need is Maguire's Gold. The Thunderbird Blue is not metal flake, but a mica compound.
9. Jacking the car - remember that a floor jack that is improperly applied too far outside of the frame can crumple the front fenders. You need to get the floor jack inside the outer fender on a solid part of the frame. They agreed that the jack sent with the car is almost worthless.
10. Quality checks - I was unaware that Ford has an electronic way to check that the person putting bolts on at "THE CRITICAL POINTS" doesn't miss any. The wrenches are electronically monitored and can pull up all sort of data.
11. Drive shafts - the drive shaft when already attached to the rear axle assembly is tested for balance at about 80 MPH to a point down to 0.7 grams. Anything out of balance more than that is adjusted with weights and rebalanced.
12. Hard Top Abrasion - this has been a sore spot. The phantom chrome strip was indeed tried, but it caused just as much abrasion as did the hard top gasket itself so it was scrapped. The tape system "was not meant to look beautiful" said Mr. Fisher on more than 1 occasion. I think they are still looking into this and I do not accept it as a good fix either. The legal case in Chicago against Ford on this issue needs to proceed as I don't think they are in a big hurry to fix this item. I mentioned the Expel system and there was really no comment. Sorry race fans!
13. Soft top storage - it was mentioned that if a car is stored over the winter that the soft top should be in the upright and locked position, otherwise it could have shrinkage and be difficult to return to the locked position.
2003 Model
I saw the new color called Mountain Shadow Gray and it was really impressive. It appears to have a mica like the blue. It also had the glove interior with a glove boot over the shifter knob. Just in front of the shifter knob were 2 switches (where the current panel is empty) and these are for the heated seats. The V8 emblem is on the side panel of the car "So we can tell the 02's from the 03's". I personally don't like them. The 03 has 280 horses as does the 03 Lincoln LS (a beautiful new look and my next purchase as soon as I get a Ford Pin# for a better deal). The supercharged version will be out before 05 as previously listed. Mr. Fisher said a few were out and being tested, but I didn't see any (Roush racing appears to be the supplier). I didn't see any Coral colors and I think I saw an 03 painted in thunderbird Blue, but I could have been mistaken.
All in all my trip was well worth the trip and I am sure it saved alot of headaches (rather than dealing with a well intentioned, but poorly informed service manager at my local dealer). I was very impressed by the engineering (dynometer of all cars, drive shaft balancing to almost immeasurable specs, state of the art painting systems, electronic monitoring of tools used for critical areas, water/air leak testing, triangulation engineering for the cockpit) and the quality control measures used to assure the Tbird enthusiast a pretty car as well as a car that is safe and dependable. We all waited through the fan modulator crap and Mr. Fisher was bluntly honest that it was a tough problem to find and fix. Some crappy parts were brought in from an Asian supplier. They admit that the tape system is poor and not beautiful, but until more people complain I doubt that a quick fix is in store. Buy stock in the Expel system. Otherwise it looks like Ford wants to stand behind this project and looks forward to making a stronger as well as faster Tbird (a nameless employee muttered - soon we will have a real motor). This is why they are stiffening the ride even more. Drive on all tbird enthusiasts and you always have a warm and dry garage in Findlay, Ohio to store your bird and have a beverage or two. Warmest regards, Todd Leslie