Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

[jerrym3]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Halo car for me: 57 Bel Air two door HT power pack.

power pack: 283/220 hp

I had one. It was a 4dr hardtop, black/white roof, three speed Hurst (converted from a PGlide), 4:11 rear. Bought it in 62 and sold it in 65.

If I had a dollar for every street race with that car........Like an idiot, I ran the car a few times without the A/F so I could hear the roar of the carb.

One night in a hamburger joint, I the car wouldn't start. I saw smoke coming from under the hood. Popped the hood, and the engine was on fire.

Luckily, my friend (parked next to me in his 57 BelAir), had a fire extinguisher. He put the fire out, I put the A/F back on, I started the car and drove away.

Hood was bubbled.

[AZTB]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

...If low-mileage, well-maintained or fully-restored Retros bring only 10 times their cost when new, values will approach $ 400,000 or more.

Phil, you're an amazing guy and possess a wealth of information - WAY more than what I know. My take on your suggestion would be that this price (if it was to happen) will be long after I'm gone...coupled with the fact that your inflated price for this car would probably also make a loaf a bread in the $20 range, if not more. I have found a fully restored '55 for $49K...it's a beautiful car. (However, I'm not going to buy it cuz I don't have the deep pockets that many members on this site have - that's why I need a retro in the $20K range if I'm going to repurchase).

[Guest]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Good point Jim, and of course, appreciation in the value of assets and inflation both impact the price of everything. Just consider what a share of Apple stock sold for say 15-20 years ago vs. its market value today.

And yes, as I mentioned in a previous post, most current Retro owners will be gone when these cars reach the 50-year-old mark; 2052 for the 2002s. That's 35 years from now, and with 80% of TBN members 60+, that would mean living to the age of 95. I'm sure some will make it, but I doubt any that age will still be driving.

It puts both the idea of collector cars and more importantly, life itself in perspective.

[wcoates]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

just a reminder that we started a thread on re-manufacturers of modules. It was posted as a "sticky" under repairs. If anyone reading this post has had a module bought or repaired please post it ant I will update thread with all update info. Thanks!

Will look forward to Linear's updating us on his results.

[Manwithtools]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

This thread has made me pause. I love my Thunderbird and hope to drive it until one of us dead! No one really knows how long you will live, but I don't want my car to go first. I have realized in the beginning that some repair parts were not available and I accepted that. However, I do not want my beautiful cars sitting in the garage because is not available. Anyplace!! Right now, while the winter wind howls and my 'Bird is snuggled in the garage, I am concerned that at some point my Spring, Summer, and Fall adventures will halt and I can do nothing about it. While it is in such wonderful condition, should I consider selling it and buy something that will outlast me?

Please help understand where I stand with this parts issue. The TBN members have been 'over the top' with information in the past that I look forward your comments and encouragement. I am 69 year old former industrial maintenance man and I do understand most of the conversation I read in the threads, but I'm afraid I'm a little lacking in experience when it comes to my fellow members.

Thank you in advance for what I know will be very good feedback! Bob

[11TH GEN]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Bob: That's a question a lot of members consider and on the other hand a question that would never enter the mind of some others. Big help huh? As for me I got out when the opportunity presented itself and sold my 02 with 33K miles on it. I only had it two years, however, my intention when I bought it was to maybe have it four years but never have it beyond 38K miles. To the dismay of some I know this thread has some people wondering, just like you are.

[Guest]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

At some point, continued ownership of a Retro reaches a crossroads of sorts.

Many here have already indicated that they will NEVER sell ... no matter what.

Others have already sold; some for financial reasons, others because they wanted something newer and with more current technology, still others who anticipated future problems and took a proactive approach by selling before repairs/maintenance and parts became an issue.

As a purely practical matter, the Retro Thunderbird has passed its time to be a reliable daily driver with no worries about maintenance or parts availability. Yes, many owners do use them as daily drivers, however, I'm sure those owners are at least aware of the issue with parts and the risks of breakdowns. As these cars get older, the chances of problems and issues with parts availability becomes more problematic.

Members and other Retro owners with second or third (or fourth) cars have the option of driving the Retro only occasionally, and not too far from home. Members that have a Retro as their only car have to weigh the pros and cons of ownership and both the expense of maintaining and repairing an aging car along with the issue of parts scarcity.

Some members here are car collectors, or 'quasi-collectors' (no that doesn't mean they're hunchbacks), and have substantial resources of both time and money, along with patience, and can 'indulge' in the hobby aspect of owning, maintaining and showing their cars.

Everyone has to determine what Retro ownership means to them and at what point the enjoyment is overshadowed by the costs, hassles and inconvenience. That point is different for everyone and there is no 'right' or 'wrong,' just what's best for you.

[11TH GEN]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Yes, many owners do use them as daily drivers, however, I'm sure those owners are at least aware of the issue with parts and the risks of breakdowns. As these cars get older, the chances of problems and issues with parts availability becomes more problematic.

Phil, I would agree with you if you are talking about the owners on here that are pretty active. I think retros are changing hands through dealers or private owners that have absolutely no knowledge of potential parts availability issues. When I bought mine all I knew was I wanted a car with a removable HT, low mileage and stunning looks. I had only been a member on here about a month and immediately bought a pretty good warranty. I did use it for some suspension parts, whether I would have needed it for an electrical issue will never be known. I can say with certainty that I miss the car, or at least a top down car, and that's why I'll be at Mecum later this week.

[Birdlover]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Manwithtools (Bob) I'm thinking along your lines but not ready to bail out yet. I really want to hear Ron McCloud's thoughts on this thread and PCM's. After all, he has NINE of these potential problems.

How common is a bad PCM? I have read about a few here, but there are a lot more owners who have well over 100,000 miles and had no PCM problems. Don't have an ESP on either car and it sounds as if an ESP isn't going to fix a bad PCM. It''s a gamble that I think I am going to take for now.

[Guest]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Richard, you make some good points, and Ron certainly has a lot of experience, background, and with 9 Retros, certainly understands these cars from a unique perspective.

That said, he's far from the 'typical' (not average), Retro owner. I think he has resources beyond what many members here and owners in general have, and as he's posted previously, he's been able to find any part he's ever needed. That may not be true for every owner of a 2002-2005 Thunderbird.

The flip side of these issues is Retro prices are as low as they've ever been, and this is probably a good time to buy one, at least in terms of price. The long term 'cost' is another matter.

[4LOWBIRDS+7]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Manwithtools (Bob) I'm thinking along your lines but not ready to bail out yet. I really want to hear Ron McCloud's thoughts on this thread and PCM's. After all, he has NINE of these potential problems.
How common is a bad PCM? I have read about a few here, but there are a lot more owners who have well over 100,000 miles and had no PCM problems. Don't have an ESP on either car and it sounds as if an ESP isn't going to fix a bad PCM. It''s a gamble that I think I am going to take for now.

Richard I had a PCM replaced two and a half years ago to fix a power steering concern. That was $569 new from Ford, did not fix the concern, later replaced the FEM. Ford had a new one for $385, but I had mine rebuilt for $210, problem solved. My PCR has E code show up on the transmission three times. Everything from torque converter, valves, switches, and bells. Each time Ford has been able to supply the parts. PCR is now in shop having many suspension parts replaced with Ford parts. "What me worry"? The Whisper White just developed a harsh shift two to three and I will address that when the weather warms up.

[Guest]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Well there you have it.

Ron can find every part he's ever needed. So I guess if members can't find what they need, Ron may be able to help.

"Don't worry, be happy!"

[AZTB]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Well there you have it. Ron can find every part he's ever needed. So I guess if members can't find what they need, Ron may be able to help. "Don't worry, be happy!"

Talked with Ron on the phone just a couple of days ago, and no doubt he's a wealth of info regarding the Retros...has 10 of them!

[Guest]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

That may be the most obvious answer to Doug's problem.

If Ron just tells him where he gets his parts, and/or helps him find it ... problem solved!

[007Cruiser]

Re: Valid ESP Contract but Required Part Obsolete?

Ron has elves in his workshop.